Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 05:16:40 -0500
Subject: Re[2]: waiting for Godel


I think the whole debate is quite pointless at the present level of
understanding, since nobody really knows what they're talking about (i.e.,
about intelligence). The annoying vagueness of Penrose's book is certainly
a good illustration of this.

I think the issue of Platonism or not is more a matter of emotion than of
thought. Deep down, I imagine most mathematicians and physicists are
Platonic realists, although they recognize such a view is not strictly
justifiable.

Rahul

>  I think one main point of Penrose's work is to argue that
>  there are certain things we know which we don't know by
>  computational methods, and Penrose appeals in this
>  connection to Godel's theorems.  Hilary Putnam and Penrose
>  have subsequently engaged in quite a polemic over the
>  latter's appeal to Godel's theorems for this purpose.
>  It is interesting to note that Searle has sided with
>  Putnam in this set-to, though he agrees with the
>  conclusion which Penrose is trying to defend--i.e. the
>  non-computational nature of at least some of our conscious
>  thoughts.  It is also worth pointing out that whether
>  Penrose is right about *this* point or not does not settle
>  whether consciousness can be explained materialistically.
>  The computational model of the mind is logically
>  independent of materialism about the mind (at least
>  insofar as these terms are given their normal meaning in
>  philosophy).  One could hold that mind is immaterial but
>  also that everything it does is computational in nature,
>  though few people hold both theses.  However, one thing
>  that makes it difficult for Penrose to qualify as a
>  materialist about the mind, is that he is pretty obviously
>  a Platonic realist about mathematical entities, and he
>  offers no theory about how a material mind is supposed to
>  interact with entities so conceived.
>
>  Peter
>  pburns-AT-lmumail.lmu.edu
>
>
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