Subject: Re: censorship
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 17:42:39 +0000


Paul Murphy wrote:

>no, I don't find his work distasteful, taste or morals don't come into it.
>I disagree with him against a framework of ideas.  For instance, although 
>he
>constantly goes on about 'faggots' to the point of obsession, that they are
>threatening, frightening others, at one point he has a recorded track where
>his male friends are giving him head.  Emminem is clearly riven with
>contradiction of a rather juvenile kind.

and you have done it a THIRD time, Paul. If you consider only the explicit 
words of just about any lyricist, poet, or any other artist, there will be 
EXPLICIT contradictions everywhere, but that is not the POINT - or rather, 
that IS the point, since explicit contradiction is a powerful way of making 
a deeper point by breaking through fixed linguistic limitations. It's why 
Buddhists ask you to dwell upon the sound of one hand clapping.

Anthony Crifasi


  Yes, its kinda funny, but I think
>maybe a 14 yr old would be highly amused, I hardly think a person of my age
>would bat an eyelid and just hope that he can sort it all out and make an
>album which addresses some more meaningful issues.
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Anthony Crifasi" <crifasi-AT-hotmail.com>
>To: <heidegger-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu>
>Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 6:08 PM
>Subject: Re: censorship
>
>
> > Paul Murphy wrote:
> >
> > >I see your point, but I don't agree with you.  What you are saying is
> > >something similar to the enemy of enemy is my friend.  I disagree with
>what
> > >Emminem says, but  I don't believe in censoring him and that doesn't 
>give
> > >me
> > >any common ground with conservatives.
> >
> > And you did it a SECOND time, Paul. I never said that you believe in
> > censoring him. I said that the reason you do not like (not censor) him 
>is
> > the same reason used by conservatives who want to censor him: the 
>explicit
> > things he says. Conservatives conclude that he should therefore be
>censored,
> > while you only express a distaste, but the REASON is the same: what he
> > explicitly says. And that is the mistake I am pointing to - looking only
>at
> > the explicit and not what lies beneath.
> >
> > Anthony Crifasi
> >
> >
> >   Recently, a EU wide law was going to
> > >make holocaust denial illegal but the UK opposed it on the basis of 
>free
> > >speech, the UK being a liberal democracy, not a social democracy as 
>many
>of
> > >the EU countries putatitively are.  Will this make those EU countries
> > >Totalitarian regimes?  In the UK a Islamic cleric has been gaoled for
> > >thought crimes, under the rubric of incitement to hatred, is this
> > >Totalitarianism?  It pretty much looks like it.
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Anthony Crifasi" <crifasi-AT-hotmail.com>
> > >To: <heidegger-AT-lists.village.virginia.edu>
> > >Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 5:37 PM
> > >Subject: Re: censorship
> > >
> > >
> > > > Paul Murphy wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >I'm not a conservative, although I find what he says objectionable,
>he
> > >has
> > > > >the right to say it.  So why are you calling me a conservative when
> > >that
> > >is
> > > > >clearly not my stated position?
> > > >
> > > > Oh geez Paul! Look at what I wrote. I didn't say you were a
> > >conservative.
> > >I
> > > > said that "you are making precisely the mistake that so many
> > >conservatives
> > > > make," because they also "look only at the explicit, and not the
> > >meaning."
> > > > To say that you are making the same mistake that many conservatives
>make
> > >is
> > > > not to say that you are a conservative!
> > > >
> > > > >You are attempting to lump everyone who
> > > > >disagrees with you into a conservative bracket, but the truth is 
>that
> > >you
> > > > >are the conservative, celebrating junk and trivia like Emminem,
> > >celebrating
> > > > >his right to 'free speech' as if what an idiot like Emminem says is
>of
> > >any
> > > > >interest to any sane or sophisticated person.  Why don't you try
>taking
> > > > >some
> > > > >constipation tablets, maybe that verbal diahorrea will empty out of
> > >your
> > > > >system....PM
> > > >
> > > > I don't know what your definition of a sophisticated person is, but 
>I
> > >can
> > > > guess that it does not include making simple mistakes like 
>conflating
> > >being
> > > > conservative with sharing an error with conservatives.
> > > >
> > > > Anthony Crifasi
> > > >
> > > > _________________________________________________________________
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> > > >
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> > >
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