Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2006 14:55:52 -0500
To: puptcrit-AT-lists.driftline.org
Subject: Re: [Puptcrit] Kukla, Lip Synch & History


The use of figures by ventriloquists did not become popular until the 
later half of the 19th Century. However, Valentine Vox mentions in "I 
Can See Your Lips Moving" on page 49 & 50, that by 1750 Baron von 
Mengen was using a small doll figure with a moving mouth in his 
ventriloquial exhibitions.

Fred Greenspan - Traditional Puppeteer
http://www.traditionalpuppetry.com
On Jan 13, 2006, at 1:51 PM, John Bell wrote:

> Generally, in most traditions of puppet theater, there are no moveable 
> mouths (i.e., wayang kulit, Chinese handpuppet theater, bunraku, and 
> the Pulcinello, Kasperl, Petrushka, and Punch and Judy traditions of 
> Europe.  Yes, dragons (like Kukla) would have practicable mouths, but 
> more for biting than for lip-synching.  I think that moveable puppet 
> mouths synchronized to voices are more of a television-age invention.  
> Before that, most people didn't think moveable mouths were at all 
> necessary!
>
> john bell
> great small works
>
> 	-----Original Message-----
> 	From: puptcrit-bounces-AT-lists.driftline.org on behalf of Steve Axtell
> 	Sent: Fri 1/13/2006 1:17 PM
> 	To: puptcrit-driftline.org-AT-lists.driftline.org
> 	Cc:
> 	Subject: [Puptcrit] Kukla, Lip Synch & History
> 	
> 	
>
> 	I joined puptcrit 10 or 12 years ago to gain an
> 	understanding of the field with the specific
> 	purpose of broadening my awareness of styles,
> 	different views, and learn more about the history
> 	of puppets.  This is one of the great values of this list.
> 	
> 	As a kid I loved Kukla Fran and Ollie but was
> 	always really bothered by Kukla's lip sych
> 	manipulation.   The comic brilliance of Burr
> 	Tillstrom aside, Kukla's mouth usually opened and
> 	closed, biting the words rather than speaking
> 	them.  I was always pre-occupied by that.   (Keep
> 	in mind this was long before I saw Henson's work)
> 	
> 	On a rec.arts.puppetry post from many years ago I found this.....
> 	
> 	"Henson was quick to acknowledge the work of puppeteers before him. He
> 	particularly admired Edgar Bergen. While KFO was good, it's style was 
> much
> 	the same as it had been since the middle-ages. But whereas KFO used a
> 	traditional style comeplete with stage, Henson was the first to make 
> the TV
> 	screen the stage. This was a revolution in puppeteering. Henson was 
> also one
> 	of the first to lip-sync the puppet's mouth movements with their 
> speech.
> 	This made the characters appear real enough so that one could forget 
> they
> 	were puppets.   Patrick Joseph McNamara"
> 	
> 	Is that accurate?  Was lip synch never an issue
> 	in puppetry before Henson?   It's hard to believe
> 	that with all the effort to create the illusion
> 	of life, that there wasn't an effort to move the
> 	mouth as if it were real speech.
> 	
> 	I'm really curious.  Were mouth puppets not
> 	common before TV?  I doubt it but I don't
> 	know.  Punch & Judy had an Crocodile, but did it
> 	ever talk?  What other early mouth puppets were
> 	there before Kukla?  What is the time line?
> 	
> 	I look forward to learning.....thanks.
> 	
> 	
> 	Steve Axtell
> 	Axtell Expressions, Inc.
> 	****************************************
> 	<http://www.axtell.com>Amazing Puppet Characters Web Site
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> 	The original content of this email or attachments
> 	is =A9 2005 Axtell Expressions, Inc.
> 	
>
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